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Shut off while idling and will not start?

Tiny
JIMEL48
  • MEMBER
  • 2008 HONDA ACCORD
  • 2.4L
  • 4 CYL
  • 2WD
  • 160,000 MILES
Car started running rough, coils were replaced. Car continued to idle rough then stopped and would not start again. Replaced spark plugs and still no start. My question is: I am getting 12 volts at the coil wire so does that eliminate main relay or fuse as a problem? Also is there an easy way to check if timing is off?
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Tuesday, February 21st, 2023 AT 10:47 AM

12 Replies

Tiny
JACOBANDNICKOLAS
  • MECHANIC
  • 108,489 POSTS
Hi,

The idea that it was running poorly, stalled, and won't restart leads me to think either you lost spark, fuel, or the timing may have jumped.

I need you to try something. See if it will start if you use starting fluid. If it does and then stalls, we know its fuel related. If there is no change, I need you to check for spark at the plugs.

Here is a link that explains how that is done:

https://www.2carpros.com/articles/how-to-check-for-ignition-spark

Now, if you have spark and the starting fluid made no change, record it cranking and upload it for me to hear. If there is a timing issue, I should be able to tell.

Let me know what you find or if you have questions.

Take care,

Joe
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Tuesday, February 21st, 2023 AT 9:03 PM
Tiny
JIMEL48
  • MEMBER
  • 28 POSTS
Thanks for responding. Spark plug is firing, although not as strong as I am use to seeing but these platinum plugs have very slender electrodes so I believe thats ok. Used starter fluid and no change. I could tell by the fuel pump running and the plug that it is getting gas. I have attached video of engine being cranked like you asked. If you have a problem listening to it I will try to send it a different way.
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Thursday, February 23rd, 2023 AT 10:59 AM
Tiny
JACOBANDNICKOLAS
  • MECHANIC
  • 108,489 POSTS
Hi,

The cranking sounds normal, which is a good thing. If there was no change, with the starting fluid, then it has to be related to the ignition spark. You indicated it wasn't what you expected. Was it a good blue snapping spark? Also, were the plugs wet with fuel when you removed them?

Let me know.

Joe
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Thursday, February 23rd, 2023 AT 7:03 PM
Tiny
JIMEL48
  • MEMBER
  • 28 POSTS
Thanks for your input, Joe,
Attached is a video of plug firing, all 4 plugs fired when tested.
Two plugs were wet and all four smelled strong of gas.
Tried two more times spraying starter fluid in butterfly valve at
intake. No change.
Attached multimeter to both sides of coil plug. All pulsed between 7 and 8 volts. Middle of coil plug showed good ground.
Did compression test: #1 plug-195 PSI, #2 plug- 185 PSI, #3 plug-190 PSI and #4 plug 190 PSI.
Engine does not even sound like it wants to start. If the timing is good, I do not know where to go from here, do you have any more suggestions?
Thanks again for your time.
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Sunday, February 26th, 2023 AT 5:47 PM
Tiny
JACOBANDNICKOLAS
  • MECHANIC
  • 108,489 POSTS
If the plugs were wet, we need to check the fuel pressure. You may have a faulty pressure regulator or even a faulty coolant temperature sensor. By any chance, do you have a live data scan tool? If you do, check the engine coolant temperature sensor signal to see if it makes sense. For example, if it is 90 degrees outside, it shouldn't read -40 degrees. LOL

Here is a link that explains in general how to test fuel pressure:

https://www.2carpros.com/articles/how-to-check-fuel-system-pressure-and-regulator

If you look below, I attached the directions specific to this vehicle. If the regulator is bad and the fuel pressure is too high, we need to replace the regulator, which is in the fuel tank and part of the pump assembly.

Pic 4 shows the regulator and pic 5 provides the manufacturer's pressure specifications.

Let me know what you find. It sounds like it may be flooding itself.

Take care,

Joe

See pics below.

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Sunday, February 26th, 2023 AT 8:29 PM
Tiny
JIMEL48
  • MEMBER
  • 28 POSTS
Thanks Joe,

ECT was 48 degrees at 9AM and outside temperature was 62 degrees. Fuel pressure was 43 and 44 psi (44 three times). Pulled No 1 plug and was wet. Pulled pump fuse, used starting fluid and nothing. This engine is not even coming close to starting. Could the crankshaft position sensor be firing spark plug at the wrong time? I have been told that if the spark plug fires at all the sensor is good, but it makes sense to me that it could fire at the wrong time. Again thanks for your time.
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Tuesday, February 28th, 2023 AT 7:58 PM
Tiny
JACOBANDNICKOLAS
  • MECHANIC
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Hi,

No, it wouldn't change the ignition timing. If you have spark and fuel, either it is a compression issue or timing. Have you checked compression?

https://www.2carpros.com/articles/how-to-test-engine-compression

Let me know. Also, remember, we need fuel, ignition spark, correct timing, and compression. If these are all present, it has no choice but to run, so we must be missing something simple.

Let me know.

Joe
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Tuesday, February 28th, 2023 AT 9:52 PM
Tiny
JIMEL48
  • MEMBER
  • 28 POSTS
Thanks Joe,
Compression was 190, 190, 185, 195. I think it is timing too. That's why I asked about a bad crankshaft positioner. Couldn't the crankshaft positioner sends wrong info to computer making it fire at the wrong time? While cranking engine it sounds like it is not firing at the right time.
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Wednesday, March 1st, 2023 AT 5:58 AM
Tiny
JACOBANDNICKOLAS
  • MECHANIC
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Hi,

The compression looks great, so chances are the timing is okay. To answer your question, yes it could affect timing if something is damaged or loose. Also, there is a pulse plate that may be damaged or loose. That will cause a timing issue. Take a look at pic 1 below.

Let me know your thoughts.

Take care,

joe

See pic below.
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Wednesday, March 1st, 2023 AT 6:01 PM
Tiny
JIMEL48
  • MEMBER
  • 28 POSTS
I will try to look at that also tomorrow. It is my grandson's car and he lives 50 miles away. Thanks again.
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Wednesday, March 1st, 2023 AT 8:05 PM
Tiny
JIMEL48
  • MEMBER
  • 28 POSTS
Hello Joe,
I am wanting to check crankshaft position sensor. Do you have the specifications IE: voltage and resistance?
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Wednesday, March 1st, 2023 AT 10:32 PM
Tiny
JACOBANDNICKOLAS
  • MECHANIC
  • 108,489 POSTS
Hi,

Interestingly, there are no specifications for the CKP.

Here is a link you may find of interest:

https://www.2carpros.com/articles/symptoms-of-a-bad-crankshaft-sensor

Let me know how things work out.

Joe
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Thursday, March 2nd, 2023 AT 8:17 PM

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