1998 Ford Windstar REAR TAIL LIGHT OUT - NOT BULB OR FUSE

Tiny
8LUGNUTS
  • 1998 FORD WINDSTAR

Electrical problem
1998 Ford Windstar 6 cyl Two Wheel Drive Automatic 67000 miles

Howdy, I have a 1998 Windstar LX with a rear tail light out, just the running light, brake, siginal, & reverse lights work fine. I checked the bulb and it's fine as is the fuse. While visiting in my hometown I stopped by my old mechanic's shop, he scanned it with a SnapOn scanner and looked up the code on his computer system, I don't know the code but it said I had to replace the tail lamp module? Or something like that. He told me it was behind the center console but when I got home and took the bottom part of that out I can see nothing but the heating/air duct system. Do you know where this *module* is? He told me there are two, one for the front parking/running lights, one for the rear. Thankyou for your assistance.

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Monday, November 17th, 2008 AT 7:34 PM

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Tiny
8LUGNUTS
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With the help of my old mechanic I found the REM (Rear Electronic Module) behind the jack bracket on the passenger side rear of the van.
As fate has it my co-worker has a 1998 LX Windstar with a blown head gasket & trans and is getting rid of it to charity, but he said I can take any part I want from it! Problem is, his is a slightly different LX than mine, it is a Northwood LX model, and when I took the jack panel off his van(which is different than mine) there is nothing behind it and no removeable bracket...so I'm almost back to square one.

Anyone know where I might start looking for this big boxy module on a Nortwood LX?

The sticker on this thing states:
"This is a programmable part"
do you know if I can take this module somewhere to be re-programmed?


http://www.2carpros.com/forum/automotive_pictures/272959_REM_1_1.jpg



http://www.2carpros.com/forum/automotive_pictures/272959_REM_2_1.jpg



http://www.2carpros.com/forum/automotive_pictures/272959_REM_3_1.jpg



http://www.2carpros.com/forum/automotive_pictures/272959_REM_4_1.jpg



http://www.2carpros.com/forum/automotive_pictures/272959_REM_5_1.jpg

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Tuesday, November 18th, 2008 AT 6:41 PM
Tiny
DAVE H
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**stop press**there is another module? GEM generic electronic module. Behind dash left side of steering column. The data lines from this module only go to the turn signals at the rear? And front park/turn signals? Have you got a feed to the the light that is out? I think it is likely you have a break in the brown live wire to the lamps both lives go to a connector behind left kick panel. I don't think it is anything to do with a control module. Simply a break in the live wire to the light that is out. Try wiring a live from a light that is working to it?

I have checked the wiring diagram for the ABS/TC module and cannot find any output wires to the rear lights?

DESCRIPTION & OPERATION
Vehicle has 2 module communications networks. The Powertrain Control Module (PCM) and Anti-Lock Brake System/Traction Control (ABS/TC) module (if equipped with traction control) are connected to the multiplex communications network through a pair of twisted wires or BUS. The BUS network is also referred to as Standard Corporate Protocol (SCP). The BUS consists of (+) circuit No. 914 and a (-) circuit No. 915. The air bag diagnostic monitor and all other optional modules, the Generic Electronic Module (GEM) and Anti-Lock Brake System (ABS) control module (on models not equipped with traction control), are connected to the ISO 9141 diagnostic communications network through a single wire (circuit No. 70). Both networks are connected to the Data Link Connector (DLC). This article is used to diagnose BUS and ISO communications network circuit faults. For module locations, see COMPONENT LOCATIONS table.
DESCRIPTION
The 4-wheel Anti-Lock Brake System (ABS) is designed to allow the vehicle to stop in the shortest possible distance while maintaining improved steering control under most conditions. Some models are equipped with traction control, which is integral with the anti-lock brake system.
ABS system consists of an Anti-Lock Brake Control Module (ABCM), Hydraulic Control Unit (HCU), 4 wheel speed sensors and toothed sensor rings, brake light relay, ABS and BRAKE warning lights, fluid level switch, brake on/off switch, and traction control switch. The ABCM and HCU are packaged in one unit identified as Electronic Hydraulic Control Unit (EHCU). The traction control valve block is 6" (152 mm) long, has 4 outlet ports and uses M12 (6 mm) tub nuts on tubes going to master cylinder.
NOTE:For more information on brake system, see appropriate DISC & DRUM article.

ABS/TC Module
OPERATION
When brakes are applied, fluid under pressure is transmitted through 4 normally open solenoid valves located inside Hydraulic Control Unit (HCU) to wheels. If Anti-Lock Brake Control Module (ABCM) senses a wheel is about to lock, based on input from wheel speed sensor, normally open solenoid valve is energized closed (pulsated) for affected wheel. This prevents fluid from entering brake circuit for affected wheel. The ABCM looks at sensor signal from affected wheel. If affected wheel is still decelerating, ABCM opens solenoid valve (pulsates), returning fluid back to HCU. When affected wheel comes back up to speed, ABCM returns solenoid valve to normal open condition, allowing fluid to affected wheel.
The ABCM monitors electromechanical components of brake system. A malfunction of Anti-Lock Brake System (ABS) will cause ABCM to inhibit system operation. ABS warning light will be illuminated on instrument panel. Normal power assisted braking will remain operational.
When ignition is placed in RUN position, ABCM will perform a self-check on ABS electrical system by illuminating ABS warning light for 2-3 seconds. When vehicle speed reaches 4 MPH, valves and motor will be briefly powered to ensure operation. During vehicle operation, ABCM monitors all electrical ABS functions and some hydraulic operations.
Malfunction of anti-lock brake system will cause anti-lock brake module to shut off or inhibit the system. Loss of hydraulic fluid in brake master cylinder reservoir will disable anti-lock system.
COMPONENT LOCATIONS
Anti-Lock Control Module (ABCM) & Hydraulic Control Module (HCU)
ABCM is located under battery tray in left front corner of engine compartment.

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Tuesday, November 18th, 2008 AT 8:25 PM
Tiny
DAVE H
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The REM thingy was buggin me so I looked around and found that the 1999 windstar SE ans SEL models had them fitted? None of the 89 models have them and the 99 LX model doesn't. So if ya looking to buy one, those are the models you need to look for. Also i'm sure someone can reprogram your old one. Looking into the modles with the rear module. It does indeed control the lights. And there is a module to control the fronts? It is possible this module is broken. But I would check the connections and output's before replacing the part? Could be costly even for a reprogram?

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Tuesday, November 18th, 2008 AT 8:49 PM
Tiny
8LUGNUTS
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The scanner returned a code indicating that the REM needs to be replaced. It is a generic solution since the module could be re-programmed but it needs to be "fixed" either way. While I had the module exposed and still plugged in I started pulling the plugs(there are five), when I pulled one of them the rear tail parking light which is working went out, another one turned out the courtesy lights. If I can find the REM in my co-worker's Northwood LX I can at at least try it, problem is, where is it? It's not where mine is. Same van, same year, same model (LX vs Northwood LX) why the heck does Ford do this!
Mike

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Tuesday, November 18th, 2008 AT 11:04 PM
Tiny
RACEFAN966
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Ok here is what Dave H is trying to say. Your windstar is a late model and the other one is an early model so it doesn't have one. You need to find another late model one that is closer to or a 99 so it will also have one. I had a 98 early model and it did not have one it used the GEM instead. SO you should check with you local dealer for reprogramming or find one in a salvage yard to find a used one. Hope this helps.

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Wednesday, November 19th, 2008 AT 12:25 AM
Tiny
8LUGNUTS
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Racefan, thanks for that info. I did not want to go tearing my friend's Northwood LX apart only to find nothing.

I'm going to check with the local Ford dealer 1st to see if this thing can be tested/re-programmed. If not I'm heading to the junky.

Do you know if these REM modules are *compatible* across the entire model line of Windstars for '98? How about '99?

Thanks again,
Mike (8lugnuts)

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Wednesday, November 19th, 2008 AT 12:47 AM
Tiny
DAVE H
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Thanks Racefan. Yes that is what I was trying to say. It does seem that they are interchangeble across the range. But i'm sure ford will tell you this. I'm guessin a junky is gonna be your cheapest option on this fix. You will need to be looking for a 99 SE/SEL model. The LX does'nt have one?

Rear Electronic Module (REM)

REM is connected to SCP network. REM mainly controls the rear portion of vehicle. REM supports other locking features for all passenger doors and Right or Left Power Sliding Door Module (RPSDM/LPSDM) and liftgate. When Power Sliding Door (PSD) operation is requested, REM determines if necessary preconditions are met, and signals the appropriate PSD module for PSD operation (as equipped).

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Wednesday, November 19th, 2008 AT 5:34 AM
Tiny
8LUGNUTS
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I just discovered it's a '99. I just got it from my sister, who told me it was a '98, when I checked the title I saw it was a '99. I dropped the module off at a local used autoparts yard, biggest around here, fully computerized etc.

The guy there told me he's been looking but has not found one that matches mine yet. He asked me if the sliding doors on mine are electric, they are not, manual only, I don't think the motorized doors were available in '99. He told me my REM is showing that it's for a van optioned with the electric doors? Don't know how this would be possible unless his system is just spitting up the wrong data. I hope he finds one soon!
Apparently there are several different versions of this module depending on how your van was optioned.

Mike (8lugnuts)

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Thursday, November 20th, 2008 AT 10:07 PM
Tiny
DAVE H
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I have checked this out for you. On the 99SE and SEL models there are 2 types fitted #1 without elec sliding doors and without anti-theft built in, #2 with elec sliding doors and with anti theft built in, the parts interchange over the models. So if your vehicle has no elec doors then you need the first module.

#1 part #YF2Z13B524AA

It's the same part # for year 2000/01/02/03. As long as you have no power doors/anti theft fitted

hope this helps

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Friday, November 21st, 2008 AT 4:25 AM
Tiny
8LUGNUTS
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My van is an LX, not SE or SEL. My van has anti-theft system but the sliding doors are manual, not power. I have taken the part to 2 junk yards, both state my part# XF2T-13B524-BF is for an LX with power sliding doors. They both must be accessing the same computer reference system, but that's what they tell me. Both guys also told me Ford could have put the wrong module in my van, but it's worked for almost 9yrs? Since it's programmable I am guessing they could custom program each module for the options specific to the vehicle.
Still, it seems this problem is confusing everyone. I'll bet if I took it to a Ford dealer they would figure it out pretty fast but I'm not ready for that yet.$$$

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Friday, November 21st, 2008 AT 12:15 PM
Tiny
DAVE H
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I'm looking at OEM parts list. The modules only come as, with power doors and with anti theft or without both. The part # you have got does not show up on my system.I've just looked at 99LX the part #with both isYF2213B524BA. It's the same part right through to 2003. I haven't even got a BF listed anywhere.I'm not saying they are wrong. It's just all very confusin. Haha. Hope they get ya one soon. The price I have listed is $338 for the part # I have.?

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Friday, November 21st, 2008 AT 12:44 PM
Tiny
8LUGNUTS
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If you look at the pics I posted you will see a close-up of the sticker on the module, it's fuzzy because I could not focus that closely with my camera, but that is the part #. And it's been working fine for 9yrs so I imagine it is correct for my van. I am leary of installing a part with a different part#, unless a Ford Tech. Could verify it's okay to do it.

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Friday, November 21st, 2008 AT 7:55 PM
Tiny
DAVE H
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You are right to be leary. I would be 2. All I was saying was I couldn't find that part # listed. You could go/ring fords service dept. And ask them whether they interchange. Or even if the part # has changed exlain you are having trouble tracking a used module down. Information is free. You could just ask how much is new part and ask for part #

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Saturday, November 22nd, 2008 AT 6:34 AM
Tiny
8LUGNUTS
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You already stated a new one costs about $340. If I take my van to Ford they required a scan which is $80-85 from what I last remember. I'm certain they would charge me all of the retail price for a part like this.

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Sunday, November 23rd, 2008 AT 10:04 PM
Tiny
DAVE H
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I was saying call ford on the phone and enquire about part # to make sure the junky's are searching for correct part?

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Monday, November 24th, 2008 AT 4:15 AM
Tiny
D ROGUE
  • MEMBER

Sorry for the possible hijack, but I've been having a very similar problem with my wife's '99 Windstar.

First the bad light bulb indicator light went on on the dashboard, so I checked it out and found that the rear passenger turn indicator light was out. Replaced the bulb to no avail. Checked all fuses with a meter and all good. Then I noticed that the reverse lights weren't working. Put a meter on that and found it has a bad ground (no ground when meter hooked up to ground wire, but got power when grounding the meter to screw). Then, we had a problem where the tail lights (included license plate lights) stayed on after the car was turned off (and light switch in off position). Then the interior lights would magically turn on (and not turn off) even with the switch turned on and off again.

I pulled fuses 1, 7 and 13 (I think, going from memory) to kill the lights so the battery didn't drain overnight. Now more whackiness happened this morning so I took it to the Ford dealer for a good hosing.

I'm thinking I may have an issue with the REM as well. I'll be watching this thread for updates, and will post anything I find out from the shop.

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Tuesday, November 25th, 2008 AT 1:03 PM
Tiny
8LUGNUTS
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D Rogue, no hijaak taken, we're all good in here.

Your symptoms sound much more like a defective REM than a bad ground. If you pull the big black plug off the REM it turns the dome/courtesy lights out, so you *know* that circuit runs through the REM, and it should since every door has a dome/courtesy light switch.

My mechanic/former boss probed the parking light circuit on my *bad side* with his MMeter and got no current from *one* of the three wires, but current was present on the other two. So he concluded that his SnapOn scanner produced the correct code, which very specifically stated "Replace Rear Lamp Module".

I hope they don't charge you an arm+leg to diagnose and fix it. As posted here that part *new* from Ford is over $300. I got my used one for $85 + S&H, came out to about $105 right to my door. Hopefully that's all it is with yours.

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Wednesday, November 26th, 2008 AT 6:56 PM
Tiny
D ROGUE
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Thanks Lug!

Unfortunately I was not so lucky, and they got me pretty good. Over $800.00, but that did include a service (oil change tire rotation, etc.). I called them and mentioned that I thought it was the REM and they said that they just hooked it up to the diagnostic machine dealie and were getting all kinds of faults from the REM.

Now even if I would have bought one elsewhere, like you did, wouldn't I still need to have it programmed?

Nonetheless, if there's any silver lining here (other than now my wife's car works normally again), it's that I also asked them to fix the heater that's been broken for a year or two, but then called off the dogs after reading how to fix it myself (blend door actuator) on message boards like this one. That probably saved me a couple to a few hunsky.

Thanks again for the reply and your help!

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Wednesday, November 26th, 2008 AT 10:09 PM
Tiny
WAGSIO
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Ok. Here we go with my version. I had the right rear stoplight go out and my good friend the mechanic said that power is always on to these circuits and the REM supplies the ground. The REM was bad, had Ford confirm it at $88 with an estimate for $750 to replace it. All this for a stoplight out!

Well, I went to a junkyard picked one up for $20 and installed it. Stoplight works now but our rear heat control won't work. As stated in the previous posts, this says it's a programmable part and I'm wondering if I can have it programmed for the heat option? I didn't think to check the junker if it had rear heat and I'm sure I reconnected the plugs correctly.

Ford doesn't have a clue when I called the dealer, they sent me to parts and these guys aren't familiar with the workings of the REM. Hopefully, this doesn't complicate things but maybe someone is an expert on the REM and can answer all of these problems.

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Tuesday, December 2nd, 2008 AT 10:16 AM
Tiny
DAVE H
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Wagsio. Let me know your van model and year and I will look into the REM for you. The only extra's. Ie differences when parts listed are power doors and anti theft. So really all modules should control rear heaters. Did you have any plugs left over? Or on the module was there space for another plug?

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Wednesday, December 3rd, 2008 AT 8:04 PM

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