1989 Chevy Camaro

Tiny
DMORAZAN
  • MEMBER
  • 1989 CHEVROLET CAMARO
  • 6 CYL
  • 2WD
  • AUTOMATIC
  • 150,000 MILES
My fuel pump keeps on running after I shutoff engine and kills my battery. I can hear the pump and some times it will not run. Disconected the relay and still running. What can I do.
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Thursday, November 20th, 2008 AT 9:24 PM

11 Replies

Tiny
IMPALASS
  • EXPERT
Hello -

I have attached a pic of where the oil pressure switch is. Start the car then turn it off and see if the pump is still running. If it is, disconnect the oil pressure switch.....not the sending unit, but the switch and see if that shuts it off.

If it does your switch is defective. Let me know if this works.

Also, please go to Auto Zone or O'Reilly's and for FREE they can pull the codes to the car. Most important: Once they check your codes, if they find something and you don't get it fixed and need to get back with us, please make sure you tell us exactly what the code was, number and all. Example, if the code was E0568 O2 Sensor bad. Then make sure you give us all of that. While there for FREE also they can bring their tester out and check your battery, alternator and starter. I just want to see if it threw any codes.

Looks like you may have some recalls on your vehicle. The dealer may fix these for free. Please contact the dealer service department, give them the VIN number of your car and have them check on these to see if they apply to you.


http://www.2carpros.com/forum/automotive_pictures/248015_Picture6_5.jpg




http://www.2carpros.com/forum/automotive_pictures/248015_Picture8_4.jpg




http://www.2carpros.com/forum/automotive_pictures/248015_Picture7_5.jpg


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Thursday, November 20th, 2008 AT 11:04 PM
Tiny
DMORAZAN
  • MEMBER
Thank you for the help.I change the oil sensor and the pump does not keep on running after car is turn off but now the car starts in the morning and if you drive it to the store and go shopping for 15 min to 1/2 hour or so the car will nor start and some times it will not start until latter than that or the next time some times the next day. The car cranks. Thank you
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Wednesday, November 26th, 2008 AT 2:25 PM
Tiny
IMPALASS
  • EXPERT
Hello -

Well, we have some progress.

Just to make sure, your engine is a 2.8L so the model we are talking about is the RS not the IROC-Z. Yes?

Did you ever make it over to AZ or OR for codes? If not if it is drivable, please go to Auto Zone (AZ) or O'Reilly's (OR) and for FREE they can pull the codes to the car. Most important: Once they check your codes, if they find something and you don't get it fixed and need to get back with us, please make sure you tell us exactly what the code was, number and all. Example, if the code was E0568 O2 Sensor bad. Then make sure you give us all of that. While there for FREE also they can bring their tester out and check your battery, alternator and starter.

We need to figure out if it is electrical or fuel related. Pull a plug wire off of the spark plug and insert something into the end of it and have someone try to start the car and have the metal object really close to a piece of metal on the engine and see if you are getting a good strong popping blue spark. Don't have your hands on any part of the metal! If there is no spark, then it is electrical. If you are getting good spark then you need to get a fuel pressure check on the fuel pump to ensure it is putting out okay. You could also, if you are getting good spark (check more than just one) then spray some starting fluid in it and see if it starts then.

You might consider changing the fuel relay. It is possible since the pump has been running so much that the relay is defective or even the pump now is wore out. This is a guess but something to keep in mind since it does have 150K and it has been running so much.

I hope you and your family have a nice Thanksgiving.
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Wednesday, November 26th, 2008 AT 7:44 PM
Tiny
DMORAZAN
  • MEMBER
Thank you for your help. Unfortunately in Ca auto zone ot other parts store will not read your codes or let you rent the scanner. That is a new law here in CA but I have done my work and have the sequence of the engine light flashes but do not have a way to find out how to read them or look at the pattern of the flashes to tell me what code it is. I video tape the flashes and them put them on paper and I ca see a pattern but the manuals that I have do not have it can you help me find the pattern or what can I do. Thank you
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Sunday, November 30th, 2008 AT 11:16 AM
Tiny
IMPALASS
  • EXPERT
Okay. See if this helps.

The light will flash and you count the flashes. The code will flash this way. One flash for the "1" digit then a pause then two flashes for the "2" digit. Code 12 will show three times. If there is no problem, Code 12 will continue to flash.

If there is a problem, one or more trouble codes will flash. Watch for the code(s) to flash in the same manner as Code 12. For example, code 33 is: three flashes - a pause - three flashes.

So if you were starting off you would get code 12 and 33. So it would be:

One flash - pause - Two Flashes - pause - One flash - pause Two flashes - pause One flash - pause - Two flashes - pause - three flashes - pause - three flashes - pause - three flashes - pause - three flashes - pause - three flashes - pause - three flashes

So you have. 12-12-12-33-33-33

So your code is 33.

Well, I didn't know you were in CA. Yes.A dumb law. Heaven forbid you fix your own car.

Does the above help with reading it?

I do need to make sure you did the above on what I ask. So please ensure you answer those questions and do those tests. The codes are important but we may need to go other avenues. The above items were:

Just to make sure, your engine is a 2.8L so the model we are talking about is the RS not the IROC-Z. Yes?

We need to figure out if it is electrical or fuel related. Pull a plug wire off of the spark plug and insert something into the end of it and have someone try to start the car and have the metal object really close to a piece of metal on the engine and see if you are getting a good strong popping blue spark. Don't have your hands on any part of the metal! If there is no spark, then it is electrical. If you are getting good spark then you need to get a fuel pressure check on the fuel pump to ensure it is putting out okay. You could also, if you are getting good spark (check more than just one) then spray some starting fluid in it and see if it starts then.

You might consider changing the fuel relay. It is possible since the pump has been running so much that the relay is defective or even the pump now is wore out. This is a guess but something to keep in mind since it does have 150K and it has been running so much.
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Sunday, November 30th, 2008 AT 8:42 PM
Tiny
DMORAZAN
  • MEMBER
I have a code 14 and 44 and once again you can start the car run it and then it will not start again. Thank you for your help.
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Sunday, November 30th, 2008 AT 9:07 PM
Tiny
IMPALASS
  • EXPERT
Hello - dmorazan

Okay - 14 is Coolant Temp Sensor is reading high indications.

Code 44 is oxygen sensor is reading lean exhaust.

You need to do this when it quits. The test I had above. Pull a plug wire off of the spark plug and insert something into the end of it and have someone try to start the car and have the metal object really close to a piece of metal on the engine and see if you are getting a good strong popping blue spark. If not, please do so. Don't have your hands on any part of the metal! If there is no spark, then it is electrical. If you are getting good spark then you need to get a fuel pressure check on the fuel pump to ensure it is putting out okay. You could also, if you are getting good spark (check more than just one) then spray some starting fluid in it and see if it starts then.

We need to narrow it down to spark or fuel. My first thought is your fuel pump. If it is not putting out enough. The fuel will be lean. Thus the code 44. I am still looking at the 14. But for now. Can you do the check above and let me know.
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Sunday, November 30th, 2008 AT 10:14 PM
Tiny
DMORAZAN
  • MEMBER
I just took it for a ride and then took it back home waited some time and then try to start the car. The car would not start and tested the spark on the coil and got nothing. I try to do this way back but the car did started back then and had a goo spark. This time or today it did not have any spark at the coil or at the spark plug wire and tested a few. Thank you, and will be donating some money for you soon
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Monday, December 1st, 2008 AT 7:08 PM
Tiny
IMPALASS
  • EXPERT
Hello -

Okay here are a couple of checks you can run. I wasn't sure if you had an internal or external coil so I attached the test for both.

Let me know if this helps.


http://www.2carpros.com/forum/automotive_pictures/248015_External_Coil_1.jpg




http://www.2carpros.com/forum/automotive_pictures/248015_External_Coil_2_1.jpg




http://www.2carpros.com/forum/automotive_pictures/248015_Internal_Coil_1.jpg




http://www.2carpros.com/forum/automotive_pictures/248015_Internal_Coil_2_1.jpg




http://www.2carpros.com/forum/automotive_pictures/248015_Coil_Again_1.jpg




http://www.2carpros.com/forum/automotive_pictures/248015_Coil_Again_2_1.jpg

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Monday, December 1st, 2008 AT 8:31 PM
Tiny
DMORAZAN
  • MEMBER
I change the ignation module and that did it thank you for your help. And the end of the week I will donate some money for you as promise but I have another problem with the car even before this happen. The car keeps on shutting off when I stop at a stop light but not all the time but it keeps on happening what can I do?
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Wednesday, December 3rd, 2008 AT 6:42 PM
Tiny
IMPALASS
  • EXPERT
Hello -

This seems similar to what you were saying before. Try checking the codes again and see if there are any new codes.

Perform the tests as above to check for spark or fuel. You may be in the middle of the road so you are going to have to figure a way to do it quick or hopefully it will do it in your driveway etc. You might also try just driving the car around in an unpopulated area and stopping. Then taking off then stopping to try to duplicate it. Once it quits....jump out and check for spark and if you have spark...then spray the starter fluid and see if it cranks.

You might try if you feel it going to die put it in neutral and see if that makes a difference.

Idle speed is affected by your temp sensor and you did have a 14 code.

I have attached the check out of the IAC and some other things to check.


http://www.2carpros.com/forum/automotive_pictures/248015_iac_1.jpg



CIRCUIT DESCRIPTION :

The ECM will control engine idle speed by moving the IAC valve to control air flow around the throttle plate. It does this by sending voltage pulses to the proper motor winding for each IAC motor. This will cause the motor shaft and valve to move in or out of the motor a given distance for each pulse received. ECM pulses are referred to as "counts".

To increase idle speed - ECM will send enough counts to retract the IAC valve and allow more air to flow through the idle air passage and bypass the throttle plate until idle speed reaches the proper RPM. This will increase the ECM counts.
To decrease idle speed - ECM will send enough counts to extend the IAC valve and reduce air through the idle passage around the throttle plate. This will reduce the ECM counts. Each time the engine is started and then the ignition is "OFF" the ECM will reset the IAC valve.
This is done by sending enough counts to seat the valve. The fully seated valve is the ECM reference zero. A given number of counts are then issued to open the valve, and normal ECM control of IAC will begin from this point. The number of counts are then calculated by the ECM. This is how the ECM knows what the motor position is for a given idle speed. The ECM uses the following information to control idle speed.

Battery voltage
Engine speed
Coolant Temperature
A/C clutch signal
Throttle Position Sensor
Don't apply battery voltage across the IAC motor terminals. It will permanently damage the IAC motor windings.

TEST DESCRIPTION : Numbers below refer to circled numbers on the diagnostic chart.

Continue with test even if engine will not idle. If idle is too low, "Scan" will display 80 or more counts, or steps. If idle is high it will read "O" counts. Occasionally an erratic or unstable idle may occur. Engine speed may vary 200 rpm or more up and down. Disconnect IAC. If the condition is unchanged, the IAC is not at fault. If there is a system problem, proceed to diagnostic aids below.
When the engine was stopped, the IAC valve retracted (more air) to a fixed "Park" position for increased air flow and idle speed during the next engine start. A "Scan" will display 140 or more counts.
Be sure to disconnect the IAC valve prior to this test. The test light will confirm the ECM signals by a steady or flashing light on all circuits.
There is a remote possibility that one of the CKTs is shorted to voltage which would have been indicated by a steady light. Disconnect ECM and turn the ignition "ON" and probe terminals to check for this condition.
DIAGNOSTIC AIDS :

Engine idle speed can be adversely affected by the following:
Park/Neutral Switch - If ECM thinks the car is always in neutral, then idle will not be controlled to the specified rpm when in drive range.
Leaking injector(s) will cause fuel imbalance and poor idle quality due to excess fuel. See CHART A-7.
Vacuum or crankcase leaks can affect idle.
When the throttle shaft or throttle position sensor is binding or sticking in an open throttle position, the ECM does not know if the vehicle has stopped and does not control idle.
Check AIR management system for intermittent air to ports while in "Closed Loop".
In addition to electrical control of EGR, be sure to examine the EGR valve for proper seating.
Faulty battery cables can result in voltage variations. The ECM will try to compensate, which results in erratic idle speeds.
The ECM will compensate for A/C compressor clutch loads. Loss of this signal would be most apparent in neutral.
Contaminated fuel can adversely affect idle. Perform injector balance test CHART C-2A.
If all OK, refer to TESTING PROCEDURES/DIAGNOSIS BY SYMPTOM/STALLS-ROUGH,UNSTABLE OR INCORRECT IDLE.
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Wednesday, December 3rd, 2008 AT 8:09 PM

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