Mechanics

COUPLE PROBLEMS.

2000 Hyundai Sonata

Engine Cooling problem
2000 Hyundai Sonata 6 cyl Two Wheel Drive Automatic 80k miles

my car recently has had 3 problems. 1 is idle sensor issue, oxygen sensor issue and overheats when idling.

question1: how many oxygen sensor are there on my car? And locations? Can I do it myself?

questions 2. Are universal 12" fans fit my car? My fan is working finicky( turns sometimes then stops then I hit the fan physically it starts going again).

****Since I removed the idle sensor to put on cam sensor. Can it just be I placed on wrong when I screwed it back on? Or the sensor is gone( computer gave error code).
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Arash123
August 28, 2010.




Hi arash123,

Thank you for the donation.

There are 4 O2 sensors in your vehicle and it can be a DIY job but access to some are not that easy.

Fans motors are not universal and there are various types. You need to get the one that fits and the fan blades can be reused.

When you need to judder the fan into motion, it indicates the carbon brushes are running out and it is a matter of time before it fails completely.

What is/are the trouble codes that you are getting?

KHLow2008
Aug 29, 2010.
A guy did a quick scan on my car because the car was having idle trouble. The rpm on idle is way too high. Ex. When the car is on uphill and on idle it drive easily with decent speed which I feel is strange.

Also, question about the two front fan. The left is radiator fan? And right is a/c fan? Or vice versa? And are they same fan or different fans to be installed. Furthermore, le do I need to change both fan or one should be enough for now? ( Again left fan needs to be hit to rotate again right does not work at all)
HE also got oxygen sensors. Which I have to do diagnostic test again to determine which one?

Thanks.

Tiny
Arash123
Aug 30, 2010.
When a scan is done, trouble codes would be retrieved. I requested for the trouble codes but they were not provided.

Right side is the condenser fan while left is the radiator fan. If only one is faulty, you need not replace both.

KHLow2008
Aug 30, 2010.
Hi I changed radiator fan. The car does not heat up as much as it did before. The fan turns on nicely. But although it is very hot day today the gauge will slightly go up abit passed the center when Idle still. This is worrying me. Not as intense though.

I put it up diagnostic: and this what I got.

P1510
p1511

p0120
p0134
I wonder if the engine is over running and heating up fast?

I had never had these codes before I changed the camposition SENSOR. Wonder if the mechanics broke these trying to get to the cam sensor which was difficult to get to.
*****Which the oxygen code. P0134 I got no activity (B1/S1) which oxygen sensor is that on Hyundai sonata 2000 v-6?

Tiny
Arash123
Sep 1, 2010.
Furthermore? I bought a idle control valve. Should I buy a throttle sensor as well?

Tiny
Arash123
Sep 1, 2010.
Before proceeding further, check if the TPS and ISC connectors had been mistakenly swapped. ISC connector should have the following wire colors : 1. Orange/black
2. Blue
3. Pink.

Throttle Position Sensor has : 1. Green/White.
2. Blue
3. Black/White

P0134 = Bank 1 sensor 1 = on bottom of right exhaust manifold. Check the wiring connections first.

KHLow2008
Sep 2, 2010.
Hi thanks,

The wiring seems fine as you said. One think I am wondering is do I need to cleanse the throttle body itself too?

Couple weeks ago I got this engine cleanser that you put in your gas pump. I wonder if that did something?

To check for wiring o2 sensor do I do it with ohm meter?
Thanks.

Tiny
Arash123
Sep 2, 2010.
Here are diagnostic procedures.

DTC P0133, P0134: FRONT HO2S CIRCUIT SLOW RESPONSE OR NO ACTIVITY DETECTED
NOTE: There is a Heated Oxygen Sensor (HO2S) before and one after the catalytic converter. The front HO2S measures oxygen content of exhaust gases and is used to control air fuel mixture. The rear HO2S is used to determine the efficiency of the catalytic converter. ECM calculates catalytic converter efficiency by comparing front and rear HO2S signals.

Failure Conditions
1. ECM will set DTC P0133 and illuminate MIL when ECM does not sense the following condition during 2 drive cycles: " Over a period of 2.3 seconds, ECM must detect 10 cycles from lean-to-rich or rich-to-lean when engine speed is 2000-3000 RPM, engine load range is 1.9-4.7 milliseconds, catalytic converter temperature is more than 673 F (356 C) and system is in closed loop.
" ECM must make some correction in air fuel ratio within 133 seconds when engine speed is 1600-2400 RPM, engine load range is 1.35-1.80 milliseconds, catalytic converter temperature is more than 673 F (356 C) and system is in closed loop.
" DTC P0133 indicates engine air fuel ratio is not being adjusted by front HO2S signal or ECM as expected, or as often as expected when engine is at normal operating temperature or normal use.

2. ECM will check rear HO2S operation after engine has operated for 3 minutes and 20 seconds. ECM will measure front HO2S output voltage when rear HO2S output voltage is more than 500 mV (0.5 volt). ECM will set DTC P0134 and illuminate MIL, if during 2 drive cycles the front HO2S output voltage is not 400-600 mV (0.4-0.6 volt) for 5 seconds. This DTC indicates front HO2S is not active within expected range once the engine is at normal operating temperature.

Test Procedures

1. Turn ignition on and connect scan tool to data link connector. Verify DTC P0133 or P0134 is set. If DTC P0135 is also set, repair DTC P0135 first.

2. Start engine and allow to idle at normal operating temperature. Increase engine speed to 4000 RPM. Using scan tool, monitor HO2S voltage. If voltage is zero volts, go to next step. If voltage is constant and approximately 450 mV (0.45 volt), go to step 4. If voltage varies, but stays less than 500 mV (0.5 volt - lean), go to step 6. If voltage varies, but stays more
than 500 mV (0.5 volt - rich), go to step 7. If voltage varies between 100 and 900 mV (0.1-0.9 volt), go to step 8. If voltage is constant and approximately 5.0 volts or 12.0 volts, repair short to voltage in wiring harness. When repairs are completed, clear DTCs and
verify HO2S operation.

3. Disconnect front HO2S 4-pin connector. If DTC P0133 is set, voltage displayed on scan tool should be approximately 450 mV (0.45 volt). If DTC P0134 is set, voltage displayed on scan tool should be approximately 500 mV (0.5 volt). If voltage is as specified, replace suspect HO2S. If voltage is not as specified, repair short to ground in Yellow wire between HO2S connector terminal No. 1 and ECM 88-pin connector terminal No. 12. When repairs are completed, clear DTCs and verify HO2S operation.

4. While engine is operating, backprobe between HO2S 4-pin connector terminals No. 1 and 2, and measure voltage. If voltage changes from less than 500 mV (0.5 volt) to more than 500 mV (0.5 volt), go to next step. If voltage does not change, replace HO2S. When repairs are completed, clear DTCs and verify HO2S operation.

5. Turn ignition off. Disconnect front HO2S 4-pin connector and ECM 88-pin connector. Using a jumper wire, connect HO2S connector terminal No. 1 to ground. Measure resistance between ground and ECM connector terminal No. 12. If resistance is one ohm or less, ensure ECM connector terminals are clean and tight. If PCM connector are okay, replace front HO2S. Clear DTCs and verify HO2S operation. If problem persists, replace ECM. If resistance is more than one ohm, repair open or cause of high resistance in circuit between HO2S and ECM. When repairs are completed, clear DTCs and verify HO2S operation.

6. If voltage varies and is always less than 500 mV (0.5 volt - lean), check air inlet downstream of Mass Airflow (MAF) sensor for leaks or damage. Check exhaust manifold for cracks or leaks. If any leaks or damage is found perform repairs as necessary. If no leaks or damage is found, go to next step.

7. Perform fuel pressure inspection. If fuel pressure is within specification and no pressure leak-down is detected, go to next step. If fuel pressure is not as specified, repair fuel system as necessary. When repairs are completed, clear DTCs and verify HO2S
operation.

8. Turn ignition off. Disconnect ignition coil connector. Connect voltmeter between negative battery cable and cable attachment located on engine. Measure voltage drop across negative battery cable while cranking engine. If voltage drop is less than 0.5 volt, go to next step. If voltage drop is more than 0.5 volt, replace negative battery cable. When repairs are completed, clear DTCs and verify HO2S operation.

8. Disconnect negative battery cable and measure resistance between generator housing and engine ground point. If resistance is one ohm or less, go to next step. If resistance is more than one ohm, clean mating surfaces of generator housing and engine. When repairs are completed, clear DTCs and verify HO2S operation.

10. If MIL is illuminating intermittently and DTC P0133 is set, problem is most likely a poor ground circuit. Clean negative battery terminal and engine ground. In addition, clean mating surfaces of generator housing and engine. If MIL was illuminated and DTC P0133 or P0134 is set, replace front HO2S. When repairs are completed, clear DTCs and verify HO2S operation.
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KHLow2008
Sep 2, 2010.
THANK YOU. Right now I am scared of engine overheating I will take care of that after.

Here is what I have done.

1. I opened the cap of radiator and let the coolant pour out with guidance of mechanics. I noticed lots of bubble and rust as it was rushing out. What does that mean?

2. I noticed the radiator fan was finicky on and off when I hit it turned on. So I replaced the fan motor and now it works fine. (A/.C fan does not work still.)

3. Next I checked the the water pipe out of engine and radiator system and it was hot and so was thermostat. Very hot? Why?

Could this mean radiator problem?

I am baffled. What's wrong. I can tell the engine is hot you can barely touch it and also when driving the temperature gauge is fine but when is idle it starts to rise. Please help me, I am going insane I spend alot already and have no money to buy new car since I spend alot on this car. I thought fixing fan as mechanic said would solve the problem.

Tiny
Arash123
Sep 2, 2010.
You should not have attempted to open the the radiator cap when the coolant is hot. It should be done on a cold engine.

When the coolant have heated up and there are air trapped in system, the coolant would bubble out.

It could mean a bad head gasket as well.

The radiator fan working when you vibrate it is because the cabon brushes are almost worn and have intermittent vontact. It would fail completely sooner or later. As to the condenser fan, it could be faulty. One way of test it is to disconnect the connector and apply direct battery voltage to 1 terminal and grounding the other.

The upper hose would be hot when coolant is being sent to the radiator to be cooled. If the lower hose is hot, then the radiator could be partially clogged reducing its cooling efficiency. With only one fan working, the cooling efficiency would be lower and prolonged starting of the engine could cause the temperature to increase gradually.

KHLow2008
Sep 3, 2010.

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