OBD Port has no power?

Tiny
DAVE02903
  • MEMBER
  • 2004 MINI COOPER S
  • 1.6L
  • 4 CYL
  • 2WD
  • MANUAL
  • 149,000 MILES
Hi,

I have an OBD port on my car listed above with no power. I can't find any information on what fuse to check. Can you please help?

Thanks,
Dave
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Friday, August 5th, 2022 AT 3:43 PM

27 Replies

Tiny
AL514
  • EXPERT
Hello, check the back of the connector too, over the years they get used a lot, but there's two power feeds on this one.
Inspect this fuse panel for water intrusion on the back side as well. It may have corrosion on the pins underneath.

https://www.2carpros.com/articles/how-to-use-a-voltmeter
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Friday, August 5th, 2022 AT 5:04 PM
Tiny
DAVE02903
  • MEMBER
Thank you for the information. I just bought this car so I'm just learning about it. I checked the fuses list in the diagram F3 and F36 and they are both good. I still have no power to the OBD port. I will try your other suggestion to remove the fuse box and check behind it for corrosion.

I have a second question. The fuse box under the hood has a 50A fuse for FL10 missing. I'm not sure if there should be a fuse there and what it is for. Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks
Dave
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Saturday, August 6th, 2022 AT 5:42 AM
Tiny
AL514
  • EXPERT
Try taking those two fuses out and inspect them up close and take a look into the female pins where they go. See if there's any sign of corrosion. Also, when you checked for power at the DLC how where you checked it? Were you using a multimeter and what were you using for Ground? If you didn't, try using pins 4 and 5 of the DLC and you have to have the key On. I'll try to find this missing FL10 50amp fuse, there's a bunch of other 50-amp fuses, it's a pretty high amperage circuit for those. And just lightly touch the pins, don't spread the pins on the DLC or you'll never get a scan tool to communicate.

Is there no label on the underside of the Fuse box cover? Also, the owner's manual in the glovebox should have all the fuses listed. So far, all I'm finding is the location of FL10, I'm going to keep looking, but check the manual as well.

Ok so it looks like FL10 50A is for "K416, Relay for Heated Front Screen" It's a Windshield defroster system. It might be some type of integrated defroster built into the windshield. The fuse might be out because there might be a short circuit in the window grid and they didn't want to replace the window, in some situations like that. But if your regular defrost works I wouldn't worry about it. The wiring diagrams for this car are very spotty and difficult to find for some reason.
Your main defrost actually uses the ac compressor to help frost the window because it will blow out very dry air and along with the heat this helps to get rid of the moisture a lot faster.

One other thing, is the Battery in the rear of the vehicle on this model? I've read that the battery connections get very corroded where it is located. So I would take a look at the Battery and any bulk connectors back there if it is located in the rear. Since you just got this vehicle a good look around at as many connections and wiring, as well as all the Ground connections to the body and engine block, might save you a lot of headaches in the future. Make sure all Ground locations are very clean and tight.
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Saturday, August 6th, 2022 AT 11:08 AM
Tiny
DAVE02903
  • MEMBER
Thanks for the info. Yes, I'm using a meter to check the voltage on the OBD port. I used pin 4 for the ground and pin 16 for the power. When I do that, I get a little less than 2 volts register. When I use pin 4 for a ground and touch the meter to both sides of the fuses F3 and F36 I get a little less than 12 volts on both sides of the fuse, so I think they are okay as well as pin 4 as a ground. So, it looks like I'm not getting full power on pin 16. I don't know where to go next. It's a 2004 so I don't have the manual.

Here are a couple of pictures of the fuse box under the hood:

Thanks for all your help.

Dave
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Saturday, August 6th, 2022 AT 11:58 AM
Tiny
AL514
  • EXPERT
Are you getting power on Pin 1 of the DLC, or is that 2 volts as well? Only 2 volts on pin 16 means that red/blue/yellow (and I don't know why they are using 3 colors for 1 wire), but that wire has a poor connection somewhere or has a corroded connector. There is a lot of voltage drop on that wire. I'll try to see if I can find any connectors on that wire. These wiring diagrams are terrible. The aftermarket ones (which I'm showing you) are the only ones that show the whole circuit. The OEM ones are broken up into small pieces everywhere, so it's a bit slow going. Let me know if the Battery is in the rear of the vehicle. And I'll see if I can trace that F3 fuse some more. Were you able to get behind this driver side Footwell trim? If the Battery is in the rear of the vehicle, I'm guessing they are running this wire under that trim down by your left leg and towards the rear of the vehicle. It's probably in the worst place for a wire to be. Most are.
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Saturday, August 6th, 2022 AT 12:21 PM
Tiny
DAVE02903
  • MEMBER
Okay, I will check Pin 1. Sorry I forgot to tell you the battery is in the rear, and it is a new battery.
I really appreciate your help. I just bought the car on Wednesday and if I can't get this fixed, I won't be able to get it inspected which is due. So, the car would be worthless.

Thanks again
Dave
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Saturday, August 6th, 2022 AT 12:25 PM
Tiny
DAVE02903
  • MEMBER
Oh yes, I wasn't able to get behind the driver side footwell trim. I was looking for some YouTube videos to see how to do that but couldn't find any. I will keep looking.

Dave
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Saturday, August 6th, 2022 AT 12:28 PM
Tiny
AL514
  • EXPERT
Okay, the first diagram is your driver side foot well; the second is the backside of that fuse panel and connector X10200 is the connector for fuse F3. Check the entire area for water intrusion. A corroded connector is almost definitely why you are only getting around 2 volts. And as for your inspection, worst case scenario, we have your de-pin pin 16 and run a 12-volt wire to it to get through inspection, we'll have you tape up pin 16 really good so it can go back in the DCL later and not be shorted out.
From the look of where this fuse panel is, it's in the perfect spot for water intrusion.
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Saturday, August 6th, 2022 AT 12:32 PM
Tiny
AL514
  • EXPERT
A lot of times the trim that runs along where the bottom of the front door will close against will pull up and have plastic tabs underneath them that snap back down when reinstalling them. I'm trying to find you a picture, but usually there will be one piece of trim overlapping another and they have to be removed first to get the section closer to the fuse panel out.

It's the Left Footwell Trim you're trying to get out. They have all kinds of names for everything, for example the Pillar "A" is the upper plastic strip going to the roof. I'm having a lot of trouble finding the pictures. But the strip down by your left foot that runs along the bottom of the door opening probably just pops up and out, most do.
This picture is the passenger side door, but the piece I'm referring to is in green. That lower piece usually pulls up and has plastic tabs, we just need to get a look at the backside of that fuse panel where F3 is.
The fuse panel looks like it needs to be unbolted to come out.

Okay, I found something, this isn't shown on the aftermarket wiring diagrams, but there is a connector (X15) in between the Data Link Connector and Fuse F3, its under that plastic panel that the fuse box is in. If you have 12 volts at fuse F3 and not a pin 16, this connector looks like the only thing in the middle of the 2. So, I think you're going to find all the problems under that plastic panel in the 3rd picture below. Pin22 of connector X15 is the 12v power feed to the DLC.

If you find that there are any corroded connectors under there, then there might be a leak in the windshield seal or the door seal. That is a very common place for water intrusion.
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Saturday, August 6th, 2022 AT 12:51 PM
Tiny
DAVE02903
  • MEMBER
Thanks, I will try tomorrow to get the fuse panel off to get to the back of it. Thanks for giving me some hope about the inspection. I did check Pin 1 and pin4 together with the key on and I get 11.97 volts.

Dave
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Saturday, August 6th, 2022 AT 1:41 PM
Tiny
AL514
  • EXPERT
Look above, there's more information.
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Saturday, August 6th, 2022 AT 1:42 PM
Tiny
DAVE02903
  • MEMBER
Good morning,

I finally got the panel off as well as the fuse box. There is some corrosion on the connectors. How do I remove that without damaging the connector? It is pretty tight I don't want to spread the pins by sticking something in. Is there some kind of spay I could use?

Dave
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Monday, August 8th, 2022 AT 8:46 AM
Tiny
AL514
  • EXPERT
Yes, there is terminal cleaning spray you can get. I think Deoxit is the best. And maybe use a small toothbrush with it, they have whole kits you can buy. But they're expensive. Look into the back of the connector too, see how bad it is in there as well. You need to get it as clean as possible, or it will just grow again, and spread through the whole connector and even short out pins together. Was it the X15 connector? It some situations where it's really bad we take the connector apart by de-pinning it and clean it that way. But try the spread and a small brush first.
Now the question is where did the moisture come from. To find water leaks, I close up the door and hold a hose over the window and door seal to see if any water gets inside. Having someone in the car with a flashlight helps a lot, to spot any drips of water. That whole fuse box could get corroded to the point where it would need to be replaced.

You can Google automotive terminal cleaning spray, but I think this one is the best.
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Monday, August 8th, 2022 AT 10:42 AM
Tiny
DAVE02903
  • MEMBER
Thanks for the info on the spray. The corrosion is on the connectors I pulled out of the back of the fuse box. I cleaned them off the best I could but still no power to the OBD. I am hoping the spray will clean it better. I haven't looked at the X15 yet, I'm having a little trouble identifying it. I will take another look tomorrow. I had to go out and buy some Metric deep sockets to get the fuse box off to look at the back of it.

Yes, I'm going to have to find the leak once I get the OBD working for my inspection. I will try your suggestion with the hose and flashlight.

Thanks
Dave
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Monday, August 8th, 2022 AT 2:33 PM
Tiny
AL514
  • EXPERT
If the connectors in the back of the fuse panel are corroded, that whole fuse box might be filled with corrosion, you have a lot of voltage drop from that fuse to the OBD port. When fuse panels get that bad, most of the time we have to replace them, because they are usually soldered together and you can't get to all the corrosion. When you unbolt it, if it's possible, try getting a look inside, it might be far worse than just the connector. Especially if it has been leaked on for a number of years. Also if pins inside the fuse panel start shorting out, you will lose communications because the X15 connector goes to the Instrument Cluster and a lot of other circuits, its a 42 pin connector.
If you find that the entire fuse box is full of corrosion, consider getting a used one from a used auto parts lot. It will cost a lot less money, you may have to take it out of a car yourself on the lot, but you'll save yourself a lot of money and headaches.
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Monday, August 8th, 2022 AT 4:17 PM
Tiny
DAVE02903
  • MEMBER
Good day,

I found the X15 cleaned that the best I can as well as the connections in the fuse box and still just the 2 volts on pin 16. You mentioned a work around to feed pin 16 with power. I think I'm ready to try that now. I went to the registry today and they wouldn't even let me register it because the inspection had expired. I have to get a safety check before they will let me register for it. The safety check is everything but emissions, but I might as well get it all done if possible. I really appreciate your help. I guess I got taken on this car.

Thanks
Dave
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Tuesday, August 9th, 2022 AT 10:27 AM
Tiny
AL514
  • EXPERT
Okay, that means you are most likely only getting 2 volts out of the fuse panel connector. I'm assuming X15 was corroded too? I think you're going to find connectors in that whole section are going to be like that due to some water leak. If we are going to run another wire to pin 16 to get you through inspection, we will need to either cut the existing wire to pin 16, tape it up so it doesn't short out anywhere and repair it with a crimp connector after you find out if the fuse panel is the issue. You do have 12volts on Pin 1 of the DLC? That would be the Fuse F36 10amp which is hot with the Key On, Pin 16 is 12volts all the time.
I'm surprised you were reading 12 volts at Fuse F3(pin 16 feed). I'm wondering how many of those fuse panel connectors on the back have corrosion in them, But anyway, since pin 16 is hot all the time, we will need to put an inline fuse on the wire we run as well.
Unless you tap into the feed from pin 1 of the data link connector, since they will be turning the key on to check for codes and communicate with the emissions station's computer anyway. But you will still have to isolate the pin 16 wire, tape the end up and hide it up out of the way a bit.
This is the correct layout of your DLC right?
Before you do any of this, just verify with the key On, that Pin 1 has 12volts. And recheck pin 16, just for peace of mind, that it's still only 2 volts, even with the key On.

Now to tap into a power circuit you can use these Blue connectors below, one half of the wire going to Pin 16 will go in one side of the connector and the whole wire going to Pin 1 will go in the other side, When you clamp the connector together, they should short the pin 1 wire and the section of wire going to pin 16 together. The other end of the Pin 16 wire coming from the fuse panel tape up with electrical tape and just put it up in a place where you know where it is for later.
Then when you turn on the key you should have 12 volts on pin 1 and 16 at the DLC.

When it comes time to repair the pin 16 wire, I use these heat shrink crimp connectors to keep any moisture out. (Picture 3) Ill draw out a little wiring diagram for you and post it in a minute. As long as you're confident in taking care of the wiring here. Either that or we dig into the fuse box and most likely replace it with a used one.
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Tuesday, August 9th, 2022 AT 12:36 PM
Tiny
DAVE02903
  • MEMBER
Good afternoon,

I worked on cleaning the x15 and the fuse box connections again just to be sure I was still not getting any voltage on pin sixteen before I did the above work around, but after several attempts to clean the connectors and pins now I'm also not getting any power on pin 1 and fuse F5 has no power before of after the fuse. I don't know what fuse F5 controls but there is no power on either side of the fuse and pin 1 on the OBD even with the key on has no power.

Do you know what fuse F5 controls?

Dave
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Wednesday, August 10th, 2022 AT 1:11 PM
Tiny
AL514
  • EXPERT
I'll take a look, what did you use to clean the connector? Was X15 full of corrosion?
It's possible that the corrosion went down into the wiring under the insulation, it does that eventually, the corrosion just keeps growing and will just get into everything
Was it F5 or FL5?
Fuse F5 5amp goes to the Instrument Cluster, only hot with key On
Ok F5 goes from the Immobilizer unit to that Fuse panel then to the Starter Motor diode and also to the instrument cluster.
We have to find out how corroded the fuse panel is and x15. It's obviously really bad, my guess is if you were cleaning it with the spray, the corrosion either got farther into x15 or into the fuse panel. The problem is they solder those fuse panels together in layers most of the time, and if you can't get the plastic housing off of it to inspect the damage, there's no way of knowing how much is in there. With no power at F5 the car may not even start now, since it's part of the security system.

Are you able to check that no pins on any connectors going to the fuse panel or the x15 connector got spread apart while cleaning? With pins that are heavily corroded and have been for some time, the pins become weak and sometimes even break right off because they have been like that for so long, If you think about it like rust for an example, rust causes metal to pretty much disintegrate. It's the same with gangrene and the white crusty corrosion that happens in vehicles, it's all the more worse with a vehicle that has a water intrusion issue. This could have been like this for years, and its just now starting to fall apart because you're doing something about it. This car would have become a no start shortly regardless, At least you know where the issue is. Some people replace computers and modules over issues like this. And they never fix the car. If you end up replacing the fuse panel and a few connectors, that's a lot better than a $2,000 dollar computer, by far.
Below is the X10199 comes from the Immobilizer Unit to Fuse F5 and goes back out to the Instrument Cluster on this connector X10200.

Also 5th diagram X10205 is for Fuse 36, pin 1 of the DLC
And the X10200 is also for Fuse 3, pin 16 of the DLC.

Last one, last 2 diagrams, that connector X10178, pin number 1 on that connector feeds power to that whole fuse panel on a Red/Yellow wire, it will be a higher gauge wire because its powering up so many components. The Red/Yellow wire comes from the Fuse Panel in the engine compartment from Fuse FL2 50amp.
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Wednesday, August 10th, 2022 AT 1:16 PM
Tiny
DAVE02903
  • MEMBER
Good morning,

Thanks for the pictures and the information regarding fuse F5. Yes there was corrosion in x15 which I cleaned with a spray. Looking back in x15 it looks like one of the pins broke off. I have been looking for a salvage yard that may have a Mini but none in this area. I may have to try and get a new one, but not sure exactly what I need.

I will take the fuse box off again and check the connections you high lighted in the picture and make sure nothing has broken or spread from the cleaning. Am I right to assume that even if the x15 pin is broken I should still get power on the F5 fuse with the key on?

If you have any ideas where I can pick up a x15 replacement online that would be appreciated. The pin that was broken seems to be for the tachometer because it was no longer lighting up. That shouldn't have any effect on the F5 getting not getting power correct?

Thanks again for all your help.
Dave
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Thursday, August 11th, 2022 AT 6:17 AM

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