Car has no electrical power?

WILL GULL

MEMBER
1998 PLYMOUTH BREEZE
2.4L
4 CYL
2WD
AUTOMATIC
215,000 MILES

This car has no security system. The car started as it normally does and I drove about 5 minutes. Upon trying to restart (engine still warm) got nothing. No dash lights, not even the digital odometer. Upon jumping it, it started and when disconnected the engine RPM went up and down. All electrical systems have gone haywire. Gauges jumping up and down. Engine warning lights and check engine light. Rear window defrosts going on and off. Headlights dim at about 2 second intervals. A random transmission code was thrown I cleared it and it didn't come back. When connecting a trickle charger, the odometer will illuminate but any load applied will turn that off. What I have done: Checked fuses and there is power in the distribution center and no bad fuses. Swapped relays around. Cleaned all grounds I can find, none found corroded. Found 4 wires with deteriorating insulation going to transmission. Soldered in new wires nicely. Still same condition. Removed alternator and checked brushes looked okay and reinstalled. P.S. Never solved the chugging starting condition but it's been that way a couple years and sure it's not related. Never failed to start. Could a short in the alternator cause this?

5 Replies

JACOBANDNICKOLAS

MECHANIC
108,269 POSTS

Hi,

It sounds like the alternator isn't charging. What I need you to is test the alternator. You will need a voltmeter or a multimeter. It's easy to do.

Follow the directions in this link and let me know what you find:

https://www.2carpros.com/articles/how-to-check-a-car-alternator

The idea that you were able to jumpstart the engine, but it would stall when you disconnected the cables, this is my first suspect.

Also, the alternator could be good, but the voltage regulator may have failed. On this vehicle, the voltage regulator is integral to the powertrain control module. This is why I'm suggesting testing the alternator's output. Also, the alternator receives battery power via a fusible link between the starter motor and the alternator (red wire on the alternator). If there is no power to the alternator, it won't charge.

I attached the wiring schematic below, so you have a reference.

Let me know what you find.

Take care,

joe

See pics below. Note: I had to cut the page in half to make it readable. I did overlap the two.

Images (Click to make bigger)

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Friday, May 26th, 2023 AT 11:22 PM

WILL GULL

MEMBER
6 POSTS

First, I have to say thank you for this essential public service. It's so important to people like me who are getting old and have no extra money, as you can see by the 1998 car I drive. That being said the alternator was my first thought as well. I took it out and opened it up and didn't see anything obvious. I had rebuilt this alt a couple years ago and I don't drive more than about 3,000 miles per year. Anyway, I started inspecting the wiring and found 4 wires inside a loosely wrapped insulation for heat. Oil seeped in and sat there and rotted the insulation on the 4 wires. I cut out about 18 inches of wire and soldered in a new appropriate nicely. Same condition persisted. I cleaned all the grounds I could find none were corroded but I polished them anyway. Keeping in mind my battery is showing 12.5 volts. Just as I was fearing the PCM might be damaged from all this, a real mechanic retired and still has his tools showed up. He hooked up his gadget and said although the battery is showing that voltage, something is wrong inside it and it has no amps. I asked how could I still have crazy electrical system after a jump start. He said let's start with this battery. The new battery and the car is running normally. Boy did I feel foolish going over fuse's relays inspecting wiring for 3 days. Good part is I found the bad 4 wires they went to the transmission. Thank you for the schematics I'll put them to good use I'm sure. Sorry I wasted your time and thank you again. PS, this car has 21500 miles been a really good car. Original engine and trans. I sent a message to you not to bother and evidentially you didn't see it yet. So, if you could email a simple verification that you've seen this, that would be great. Thanks again.

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Saturday, May 27th, 2023 AT 6:15 AM

JACOBANDNICKOLAS

MECHANIC
108,269 POSTS

Hi,

Thank you for the update. I'm glad to know it was a simple repair.

For a 1998, it doesn't have many miles. LOL I have an 88 Lebaron Convertible that I purchased new when I was a kid. It now has 9K on it. LOL I don't even know why I keep it,

Take care of yourself and please feel free to return anytime in the future. You are always welcome.

Joe

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Sunday, May 28th, 2023 AT 1:32 AM

WILL GULL

MEMBER
6 POSTS

Because LeBaron convertible is really cool! I thought they were cool when new too, lol.

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Sunday, May 28th, 2023 AT 10:29 AM

JACOBANDNICKOLAS

MECHANIC
108,269 POSTS

We are showing our age. LOL, I physically ordered it from a computer. I kept it for 10 years. It never saw rain. I had to sell it because we needed money for property (family). It had 4K on it then. 23 years later, it was sitting in town for sale. When I realized it was mine, I grabbed it. LOL It's one of the few with a manual transmission. My wife and I used it when we got married, so I had to have it back.

Regardless, you take care of yourself. Let me know if there is anything I can help with in the future.

Joe