1972 Ford Torino Repair Question
Saw you had been waiting a while--you sorta have a Uncommon Question, I might can help. I have figured many things out that seemed almost impossible to me at the time. I am not a paid mechanic, I do my thing, out of necessity! I am a "Real" Jeep Kinda Guy, never owned nothing but CJs since I began driving on the road in 1981. I've had 7 Jeeps, the last 2 (I presently have) have been revived from scratch, the Willys began as a frame/ engine/ tranny/ transfer case/ and 2 axles......NOTHING ELSE, I wired it, referencing 3 different Jeep Diagrams, as I sorta updated much of the simple 1946 wiring, to more modern standards!!! Did Him, all by myself! I may can talk you thru figuring out what goes to where. Here's some questions for you, answer honestly, so I will know how to talk you thru this stuff. Is the switch installed in the dash or on the column. I do not know a lot about the cockpit of a Torino, but I feel we can find the positions. Are you "Stuck" on using this particular switch??? Do you have the wires located, just need to know where to put 'em?.....1) Do you know how to do a continuity test w/ a voltmeter? 2) Do you have a voltmeter (you can get a cheap digital one for less than $10 at a parts store/ nice to have regardless)? 3) is it possible for you to send pics and different views of your switch? (I can modify them to show you how and what to do). WANT TO USE A SIMPLER SWITCH (as seen on left side of "Willy's" steering column?)..ARE YOU GAME for any of this?.....Your Turn....The Medic.........These are pics of "WILLY" my 1946 Willys Jeep with a Flathead L-4 134 CID engine, now a 12 Volt system, Turn signals and much more that was not original to this model
Thanks for responding. Great job on the Jeep! - almost bought a 51 Willys. Anyway, here's where I'm at - Using the test meter, I was able to get the switch wired enough to start & run the engine but there's a relay that gets connected to the switch that I'm not sure where it goes - the wire coming from the relay that goes to the switch is marked "alternator" and it has 4 leads coming out- 2 of them are orange marked "coil"(the other 2 are blue like the wire marked alternator)& I did trace another orange wire that comes from the coil to the switch. I assume the relay must be there to step down the coil voltage. Since this is a kit car, some wires were premarked - the ones that weren't, I traced. I can plug the orange coil wire direct to the switch 12v terminal & the car will run but I don't want to cook the coil if it needs to step down the voltage through the relay that has leads to the coil. The kit is a 1937 Jaguar SS100 Roadster - Ford engine & driveline. It was built in 86 so I don't know why they used such an old ig. switch on it.............
OK BOSS LIKE I SAID, IMMA JEEP GUY. THIS IS GONNA BE HARD TO READ---I'M SORRY--I DO DOUBLE SPACE AND MAKE THINGS LOOK "PERTTY" BUT FOR THE LAST WEEK, WHEN I SUBMIT...IT ALL GETS CRAMMED TOGETHER. SO SEE IF THIS STUFF IS MAYBE WHAT YOU NEED TO KNOW---LET ME KNOW IF IT IS NOT--AS FAR AS THE SOLENOID (STARTER RELAY GOES) JEEPS USED FORD STUFF....THE MEDICPASTING ON ANOTHER ANSWERxnostart Disregard the non-functioning link! I went over there and got it, Copied, Pasted, and put the pics back in! OK the 1st part was sorta for other applications, but you will see what I intended for a CJ......Ask me questions, CJ fixin' is my Crusade at this site! I will assist you on a more personal, "HOLD YOUR HAND THRU IT" level than some of the other fellers.......See other CJ5 & 7 questions in the forums, you will see the extent I go to assist CJs! CHECK YOUR FUSES!!!---YOUR OWNERS MANUAL MAY SHOW YOU LOCATIONS THAT YOU KNEW NOTHING ABOUT! REMOVE AND REPLACE "SUSPECT" FUSES SEVERAL TIMES--THIS MAY SCRAPE OFF CORROSION AND GIVE THEM BETTER CONTACT! THIS WILL WORK FOR YOU, PROVIDED THAT YOUR BATTERY IS GOOD---OR YOU CAN BE JUMPED OFF!!! REMEMBER "NEW STUFF" CAN BE BAD TOO! YOUR STARTER MAY BE BAD! YOUR SOLENOID MAY BE BAD! Try the stuff below (actions), Even if this isn't your system. Yours may not look like this, but TAKE STUFF LOOSECLEANTIGHTEN WELLDO NOT JUST PASS IT OFF AS, "IT LOOKS GOOD". Do not leave off where the Battery cables connect to the Battery clamps! (not the posts, the "squeeze connections" on the wire) Do them too! While you are at it, Both ends of Pos cable, Both ends of NEG cable. If you still have the problem. Follow Battery Positive cable to find the Solenoid. Clean and tighten the starter connection! My stuff may be OVERKILL, but at least you will know what everything is and does. Like my newly made "NELSOMATIC" stuff? I am cyber stupid, and did that! Keeps me from hunt and pecking so much! Follow POS BATT CABLE, It will end up at MR. SOLENOID, yours may look different, but function is the same Insure you are hooked up correctly and tight..... Make sure "S" WIRE is attached to the Solenoid "OLD FORD TYPE" SOLENOID SYSTEM, YOUR ACCES., MAY VARY (This was really intended for Jeep CJ People!) 1) POSITIVE CABLE FROM BATTERY 2) OUT TO STARTER MOTOR 3) ON MY JEEP, THIS GOES TO THE ALTERNATOR 4) THIS FEEDS MY FUSEBOX (ALL OF MY ACCESSORIES) 5) "S" WIRE IS FROM KEY, 12V ONLY WHILE YOU ARE "CRANKING" THIS WIRE ACTIVATES THE SOLINOID'S ELECTROMAGNET, WHICH IN TURN, CONNECTS---A and B INTERNALLY (ONLY THE 2 LARGE GAUGE CABLES CAN HANDLE THE AMPERAGE THE STARTER "PULLS"). WHEN THE SOLENOID IS ACTIVATED, IT THROWS 12V TO STARTER USING THE LARGE GAUGE CABLES (1) POS FROM BATT--THRU SOLINOID INTERNAL CONNECTION--(2) TO THE STARTER, WHILE KEY IS IN "CRANKING" MODE. THIS IS THE TOTAL REASON FOR A SOLENOID, BECAUSE IT WOULD NOT BE PRACTICAL, TO RUN THE HEAVY CABLES TO AND FROM YOUR KEY SWITCH. 6)"I" WIRE (OPTIONAL), FEEDS COIL "FULL 12V", ONLY WHILE "CRANKING", AFTER YOU RELEASE THE KEY, THE COIL REVERTS BACK TO REDUCED VOLTAGE, SUPPLIED BY YOUR KEY IN THE "RUN" POSITION. 7) "SOLENOID MOUNT" GROUND, UNIT MUST HAVE A GOOD GROUND (BATT. TO ENGINE, ENGINE TO FRAME, FRAME TO BODY [ALL MUST CONNECT, SOMEHOW] ) (3 and 4, ON MY JEEP) ARE FUSABLE LINKS, ALL ARE NOT MARKED, MY #3 IS, #4 IS NOT....ITS SORT OF A "WIRE" FUSE. IF THEY ARE GOOD, TUGGING ON THEM WILL BE JUST LIKE A WIRE, WHEN THEY ARE "BURNED UP", THEY WILL STRETCH OUT LKE A RUBBER BAND. If your SOLENOID is good---Just not getting a "Signal" from the Key--We can test that too! (then you will know which direction to chase this problem) "S" is the wire that activates the Solenoid----we can sorta cheat it! Regardless what you do to cheat it, You are suppling 12 VOLTS to the "S"('s) terminal on the solenoid....this is momentary as if you are cranking with the key STAY CLEAR OF MOVING PARTS!!!!!!IN PARK--OR EMERGENCY BRAKE ON!!!! I prefer a "Remote Starter Switch" A Jumper wire momentarily touched or a Screwdriver touching POS BATTERY or POS BATTERY CABLE to the "S" terminal will by-pass the wire from the key This will for sure let you know whether its a Solenoid problem or a Key ( ignition switch not delivering 12 Volts) This will start your rig if your key is in the "ON" Position IF YOU HAVE A CJ 5 OR CJ 7---YOUR WIRES SHOULD BE HOOKED UP, EXACTLY AS MINE ARE, IN THE PICS!!! JEEP CJ GUYS!--If you changed your coil and did not get the one that says, "FOR USE WITH EXTERNAL RESISTOR ONLY"...You NEED TO GET THAT ONE! You have just "DOUBLED" your resistance (w/ one with a internal resistor), and DO NOT HAVE ENOUGH VOLTS TO MAKE IT FIRE!!!! (your resistor is a "RESISTANCE WIRE" going to the coil already!) Please Reply, Good or Bad THE MEDIC
I ALSO HAVE A DIAGRAM OF HOW THE COIL GETS REDUCED VOLTAGE TO RUN/ A TEMPORARY FULL BATTERY SURGE TO START-UP ONLY.....CJs USED A RESISTANCE WIRE, THE FELLER I WAS ASSISTING, HAD AN ENGINE SWAP AND THE RESISTANCE WIRE WAS "GONE", SO WE WERE INSTALLING A BALLAST RESISTOR IN ITS PLACE (EXACTLY WHERE IT WOULD GO, JUST REGULAR WIRE TO/ AND FROM THE BALLAST RESISTOR)....IF YOU WILL CLICK ON "ME", AND SEND ME A MESSAGE, YOUR E-MAIL ADDRESS WILL BE UNSEEN BY OTHERS.....I MIGHT SEND YOU THIS ONE AND ANOTHER FULL BLOWN JEEP DIAGRAM IN WHICH I PAINSTAKINGLY COLORED THE WIRES SO THAT IT WOULD NOT BE SO CONFUSING TO ME---JUST ASK FOR BOTH, IF YOU LEAVE YOUR E-MAIL....THEY MAY BE EZer TO SEE/ MAKE BIGGER, ON YOUR EMAIL ACCOUNT.--THE MEDIC
Thanks, I will recheck the voltage on the terminal to the coil to see if it drops from start to run position. Here is a pic of the switch too.
The drop should be on the coil end!
Yes - that's where I'll check - clicked your name but no email came up? thanks again
Click on your name and check your messages--The Medic
On the switch B's are tied to each other - As are the A-1s & A-2s so actually I have 7 terminals since these 3 are doubles. I hooked up the starter, coil, fuel pump, and hot leads to get her to turn over & run. Starter on S, coil on I-1, fuel pump on A-1, hot from battery & to fuse panel on B. Not sure where to put wired relay - as I said it has a wire that goes to the switch that is marked on wire - alternator- & it has 4 leads coming out of it & I know the orange are marked coil. Maybe connect to I-2?
Unsure on some of this stuff you show, maybe lay the switch on paper, label and point at terminals with fixtures they run to. Can you show this relay with labels? If you look at my diagram (one I posted here)...Will send it soon to your E-mail..."I" on the starter relay is only HOT (Full Battery Voltage) while cranking, then it dies--It Overrides the Lower voltage from the key.......The Resistance Wire (on the Jeeps) Comes from The Ignition switch straight to the coil......"I" Tees in at the coil---When "I" Dies (key released, it still has reduced voltage feeding in from the Tee, at the coil, but nothing from the Solenoid), it runs on the lower voltage.........For sure on the Jeeps, are you able to sorta translate this stuff to your situation----Or is it Mega Different, and I am not helping much, or making things worse? Did this come with diagrams, or will a Ford "Something" match up, if we had a Chilton manual wiring diagram?--Watch you mail! The Medic