Will not start

Tiny
STORM1
  • MEMBER
  • 2004 ISUZU AXIOM
  • 3.5L
  • 6 CYL
  • 2WD
  • AUTOMATIC
  • 88,000 MILES
The check engine light was on. A few times it would not start at all unless I opened the hood and then closed it and then tried again to start.

Put in Seafoam and it ran for a short time and then lost power while driving. Although it lost power, the vehicle went into a short period of cranking, meaning it sounded like I was turning the key even though I was not turning the key. Would not start again after this last time I drove it and had to have it towed.

Now it cranks and will briefly start sporadically but quickly shuts off.

Things I have done so far:

Changed battery in key/remote.

Changed starting battery with new one.

Cleaned battery terminal connections.

Cleaned electrical connections with electrical cleaner.

Checked fuses- none were blown.

Switched relays for ECM with similar one in fuse box under the hood.

Cleaned throttle body.

Drained fuel tank.

Replaced fuel pump in the tank.

Replaced fuel filter.

Checked codes with Matco Scan tool- no codes showing.

Sprayed starting fluid in hose from throttle body and it will start for about three seconds but runs very rough.

Previously, both of the camshaft sensors were replaced by the dealer about 5,000 miles ago.

Timing belt was changed about 15,000 miles ago.

When I checked the live data with the Matco Scan tool, rpm's were shown and changed when cranking.

It started a few times today but when it did I pumped the gas pedal to try to keep it running and that did nothing.

Not sure what to try next.

Thank you for any help with this issue.
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Sunday, September 16th, 2018 AT 4:48 PM

41 Replies

Tiny
KEN L
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No codes concerns me. Will the engine run on starting fluid? If not lets check for spark. Please follow this guide.

https://www.2carpros.com/articles/how-to-test-an-ignition-system

Please run down this guide and report back.

Cheers, Ken
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Tuesday, September 18th, 2018 AT 11:56 AM
Tiny
STORM1
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Good evening Ken,

Yes, it will briefly start with starting fluid. Tonight I cranked it over with no starting fluid and it started and ran a few seconds a few different times really rough but it seems like it is getting a little better each day I try to start it meaning it starts a little more frequent but will not stay running.

When it does start, I push the gas pedal and it makes no difference at all and does not change how it runs even briefly.

It is really frustrating because it seems like it wants to run. The way it seems is like if I could just get it to rev up, it would blow out some carbon if it was an older style engine that had a carburetor. It is very odd because it will briefly run but pushing the gas pedal makes no change like I am not evening pushing the gas pedal.

When the fuel pump was changed in the tank, it was drained down to about two gallons left in the tank. Now I am wondering if maybe the fuel itself may have been contaminated by the Seafoam or made too rich maybe?

Any help at all I am grateful for.

Thank you
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Tuesday, September 18th, 2018 AT 5:28 PM
Tiny
KEN L
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Can you remove the air intake so you can see the butterfly to see if it opens with the throttle being pushed key on engine cranking? Can you please shoot a quick video with your phone so we can see? That would be great. You can upload it here with your response. Ken
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Thursday, September 20th, 2018 AT 3:31 PM
Tiny
STORM1
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Good evening Ken.

I had a weird suspicion there was something still going on with the fuel system after I had a mechanic change out the in tank fuel pump. Previously the old in tank pump shot fuel out when I disconnected the fuel filter and turned the key. Now that there is a new fuel pump, I tried it and no fuel is shooting out the fuel line from the in tank fuel pump. I will do exactly what you said this weekend and see if the butterfly opens and will send you a video too. This vehicle has really been hard to find anyone locally who will even work on it because all the local shops are saying they do not have the proper module for their Tech 2 scan tools.
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Friday, September 21st, 2018 AT 7:15 PM
Tiny
KEN L
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When you turn the key to the on position without cranking the engine over do you hear the pump in tank run for five seconds?
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Saturday, September 22nd, 2018 AT 11:46 AM
Tiny
STORM1
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Good morning Ken, Yes Sir it does sound like it is activating but there is no fuel coming out at the front of the fuel filter. Thank you for your help, I really do not want to give up on this truck, my father in law gave it to me this year right before he passed away. It has sentimental value and I really want to keep it. Thanks again Sir.
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Sunday, September 23rd, 2018 AT 3:48 AM
Tiny
KEN L
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Something must be wrong in the tank then let remove the fuel tank so we can get the pump out. Here is a guide to show you what you are in and diagrams below so we can see whats going on for your car:

https://www.2carpros.com/articles/how-to-replace-an-electric-fuel-pump

You must drain the fuel first.

https://youtu.be/Q5MH2gnyFH0

Check out the diagrams (below). Please let us know what happens.

Cheers, Ken
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Monday, September 24th, 2018 AT 11:33 AM
Tiny
STORM1
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Good evening Sir, I have not had a chance to remove the tank and will probably have to borrow a good hydraulic jack. I spoke today to the mechanic that changed the fuel pump with a new one and he said he will reimburse me if the new pump is found to be defective. That gives me some good news, but I now have to drop the tank and change out a pump that I believe was originally never bad. He said he threw away the original pump so, soon as I get a chance I will drop the tank. Also I tested the throttle body by turning the key and it did move some. I attached a video showing it. Thanks again Ken. Sincerely, Jeff
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Monday, September 24th, 2018 AT 9:10 PM
Tiny
KEN L
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Thanks for the video with it cranking push the throttle plate open a little to see if it starts, next use a little starting fluid to see if it will run.
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Tuesday, September 25th, 2018 AT 9:44 AM
Tiny
STORM1
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Thank you Ken. I will try that when I can have someone help me. Thanks for continuing to help me Sir. I am very thankful and will report back to you what happens.
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Tuesday, September 25th, 2018 AT 7:17 PM
Tiny
KEN L
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You are welcome, let me know.
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Wednesday, September 26th, 2018 AT 10:39 AM
Tiny
STORM1
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Hoping to get to try a few things and borrow a scan tool this weekend. Thank you Ken
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Friday, September 28th, 2018 AT 5:03 PM
Tiny
STORM1
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Good evening Ken, a great friend of mine who is an ASCE certified mechanic, came over and brought a Matco scan tool that could not find any codes other than no fuel pressure. That is attributed per my friend that the pump is not working that another mechanic put in. He did check and it is not getting spark either. My first step is to drop the fuel tank and replace the faulty pump that was put in. I think I mentioned before that the fuel pump was working before I took it to a mechanic shop and when they gave up and told me they do not know what was wrong, the fuel pump now does not work, they said they threw away my old pump and last but not least, they charged me and it appears they created an additional problem for me. Not giving up just not sure what to do next.
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Sunday, September 30th, 2018 AT 4:45 PM
Tiny
KEN L
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It sounds like you have a ECM main relay that is not working. Here is a guide to help you check it and the engine wiring diagrams to help you see how the system works. I also have the relay locations below as well.

https://www.2carpros.com/articles/how-to-check-an-electrical-relay-and-wiring-control-circuit

Check out the diagrams (below). Please let us know what happens.

Cheers, Ken
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Monday, October 1st, 2018 AT 9:39 AM
Tiny
STORM1
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Good evening Ken,

I will try to find time to work on it this week. Thank you very much for your incredible dedication to helping me and the information and diagrams. I am very grateful and am not giving up.
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Tuesday, October 2nd, 2018 AT 7:05 PM
Tiny
KEN L
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You are welcome together we can get it fixed. Please let me know what you find.
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Wednesday, October 3rd, 2018 AT 11:46 AM
Tiny
STORM1
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Good evening Sir, I finally found time to drop the tank and pull the pump. I could hear the pump make a noise but it put nothing out. I did a quick test, and when I reversed the wiring, it shot fuel out. I now believe they got the wrong pump or wired it backwards. What troubles me is when I took it to a shop the old pump was working fine, and only when they put a new pump in it quit sending fuel. I am going to put the pump back in and switch the wiring so it pumps. My other concern is, that it was getting fuel before it went to the shop so have to keep chasing it down. Did not have anyone to help me check the ECM relay but will have my wife help me tomorrow. Thank you so much for keeping me motivated and not giving up.
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Saturday, October 6th, 2018 AT 5:19 PM
Tiny
KEN L
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Good find on the wiring, it is like I tell people you can fix anything if you have the will. I am sure this is the problem. Please let us know what happens.
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Sunday, October 7th, 2018 AT 10:10 AM
Tiny
STORM1
  • MEMBER
  • 13 POSTS
Good morning Ken, still trying to get it going. I got the fuel pump and tank back in and its definitely has fuel pressure but not starting. I pulled one coil pack off and installed a spark plug into the end and had a friend turn the key. No spark so not sure what to try next. I checked all the fuses and switched the ecm relay under the hood with another one with the same part number but still not sparking. Any ideas what else I should try? Thank you Sir
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Saturday, October 13th, 2018 AT 7:26 AM
Tiny
KEN L
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It sounds like the crankshaft angle sensor is not working or you have a relay that is out.

Here is a guide to help:

https://www.2carpros.com/articles/car-cranks-but-wont-start

and

https://www.2carpros.com/articles/crankshaft-angle-sensor-replacement

and

https://www.2carpros.com/articles/how-to-check-an-electrical-relay-and-wiring-control-circuit

Check out the diagrams (below). Please let us know what you find. We are interested to see what it is.

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Saturday, October 13th, 2018 AT 11:35 AM

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