1985 Jeep CJ7 Repair Question
I have a 1985 CJ7 6cyl 258 ci. that goes through ingnition modules like they are cookies.
The last ignition box was a Echin from NAPA, which lasted just over one year. I replaced it with a BWD from Discount Auto. However, this did not fix the problem. It will turn over but will not light off. Just as I release the key from cranking to Run it seems to get some spark but this only happen infrequently and I can not make it happen again with releasing the key slowly or otherwise.
I've read one of your post that sounded very much like my problem. And I was hoping you could help me with mine. Last year, when I replace the ign. module, I also replaced the following parts since it seemed like a good thing to do for its age: battery, starter, coil(for external resistor), starter solenoid, magnetic pick-up, and ign. module.
Also I've replace the 2BB Carter with a ford carb about 4 years ago and they suggested that one of the wires from the module be rewired, which means that I had to cut and splice the new module. I have done this on the last two modules with no ill caused.
How can I test the new module, which I can not return? I am ok with voltmeters but am no electrican, and will need instruction and patience !! Best regards, Bill
OK BOSS WE HAVE A RESISTANCE/ WIRING PROBLEM SOMEWHERE
I CAN HELP YOU FIND YOUR PROBLEM
....IF YOU WILL KEEP RESPONDING...AND ACTUALLY DO THE STUFF I ASK....AND REPORT BACK WITH YOUR FINDINGS
AND NOT MIX IN WHAT YOUR BUDDY'S ARE THROWING AT YOU!
I WILL GLADLY AID YOU AS MUCH AS I CAN---IF YOU WILL INVESTIGATE THE CJ5 & 7 FORUMS YOU WILL SEE THREADS OF 75 TO OVER 100 RESPONSES THAT I HAVE AIDED WITH
DO YOU HAVE A VOLTMETER...CAN YOU USE IT WITH DC VOLTS AND DO CONTINUITY TESTS WITH IT???? (I MAY CAN HELP THERE TOO)
LETS START WITH THE IGNITION MODULE
"THEY" ARE "USUALLY" PEOPLE WHO TALK A LOT OF JUNK, AND WOULD NOT BET THEIR LIFE ON THEIR INFORMATION
PLEASE SEND ME A PIC OF YOUR IGN MODULE MODIFICATION--AND A PIC OF WHERE/ WHAT IT DOES FOR A CARB
THEN SNATCH THE IGNITION MODULE OFF---BUTT-SPLICE ANYTHING BACK TOGETHER THAT YOU MESSED WITH
TAKE IT TO ADVANCE AUTO (IF POSSIBLE)
HAVE IT TESTED 5-8 TIMES (NO MATTER WHAT THEY MIGHT SAY)
WE ARE LOOKING FOR A PASS--EACH TEST
THIS IS THE MACHINE---THIS MACHINE CAN BE USED FOR MANY DIFFERENT MODULES........THE CORRECT CONNECTOR NEEDED TO TEST YOUR MODULE IS ON THE LEFT SIDE OF THE MACHINE IN MY PIC.....I LAID IT THERE MYSELF!
I SURE WOULD LIKE TO SEE WHAT MODIFYING THE IGN MODULES DOES FOR THE CARB?
Yes still here! No real progress, however I found the info I got for the carb change. It was "Installing the Motor Craft 2100/2150 in the AMC 258/4.2" by M.E.. there was a section called "Ignition modification for the computer controlled Carter BBD". one of the statements is as follows: ... "If you have a computer controlled Carter, you will need to do this step. I say, get your jeep running before you perform this step."
There is a link for a diagram showing the difference between the pre- and post-1983 ignition system.
I did not find an explaination as to what modifying the ign module does to the carb. There are diagrams showing the changes. And the tricked ingnition is described as follows: "The violet and orange wires from the distributor must be cut, and the orange wire from the computer to the ingnition module too. Notice the violet wire from the ingnition module goes into the connector, but doesn't come out the other side. You must splice one here." "A length of wire must be added to extend the violet wire from the distributor to the ign module, The distributor vacuum advance hose is moved from manafold vacuum to ported vacuum. you should add a tee here, since ported vacuum also operates the EGR valve. The stepper motor from the Carter is unplugged."
Yes I have a voltmeter (old - fluke 77), with DC and resistance testing.
I'll be able full, take pics of the modified ign module, and take it to Advance Auto for testing tomorrow.
SO HOW MUCH OF THIS COMPUTER/ VACUUM STUFF IS STILL 100% LIKE IT LEFT THE FACTORY?
IF EVERY COMPONENT WAS STILL WORKING (OR EVEN STILL THERE) ON YOUR 27 YEAR OLD CJ....I MIGHT COULD SEE THE MODS YOU ARE SPEAKING OF
EGR---NOT EVEN ABLE TO USE IT, IF YOU INSTALL HEADERS...MY CONCLUSION IS IT IS USELESS AS FAR AS ENGINE PERFORMANCE GOES
I'M NOT REAL FAMILIAR WITH YOUR NEW CARB, BUT I DON'T SEE THE NEED TO MODIFY YOUR IGNITION AT ALL
BELOW IS PICS OF "RICK'S '85" AND MY '77 AND '46
WE CLEANED HIS ENGINE W/ PURPLE POWER
WE TOOK ALL VACUUM LINES LOOSE THAT WERE UNNECESSARY---THE ONLY ONES REMAINING ARE "PCV"--"DISTRIBUTOR ADVANCE (MANIFOLD VACUUM)" --"CHOKE PULL OFF"
TIED UP HIS MESS OF UNNECESSARY WIRING (TO BE CHOPPED OUT LATER)
WE MOUNTED THE INTAKE/ EXHAUST CORRECTLY, WHICH REPAIRED 2 KNOWN INTAKE LEAKS
WE REMOVED THE '85 STEPPER CARB (STEPPER INOPERABLE, AS MOST OLD ONES ARE)
WE INSTALLED A REBUILT 1979 BBD CARB (IT HAS NO STEPPER MOTOR, IT'S A "PLAIN JANE BBD") FROM ADVANCE AUTO (USING PROMO CODES/ ORDERED AND PAID FOR ONLINE/ PICKED UP AT STORE)----WE KEPT THE CORE ($50 REFUNDABLE) UNTIL ALL WAS 100% ON AND RUNNING, IN THE END HIS COST WAS A LITTLE OVER $200 FOR THE CARB
ALONG WITH THE CARB, WE INSTALLED A PCV FOR A '79 (MATCHED WITH '79 CARB'S COMBUSTION AIR NEEDS)
WE DID NO IGNITION MODS OTHER THAN VACUUM ADVANCE IS NOW RUNNING ON "MANIFOLD VACUUM"...NOT "PORTED VACUUM"
AFTER SETTING THE TIMING...IDLE SPEED...VERIFY TIMING....SETTING THE MIXTURE SCREWS.....RECHECK IDLE SPEED....ADJUST CHOKE....ADJUST HIGH IDLE STEPS.......IT WAS DONE!!!!!
IT PURRED LIKE A KITTEN......IN FACT, I REACHED OVER AND IDLED IT DOWN TO 250 RPM.......IT RAN SMOOTH AS SILK! (RICK ALMOST WAS HAVING AN ORGANISM!).....OF COURSE I GOT IT BACK UP TO 680 RPM (TUNE UP SPECS)
RICK IS ABOUT 60 YEARS OLD, HE APPROACHED ME WANTING TO KNOW IF I KNEW ANYONE WHO COULD TUNE HIS JEEP (HE SAW I HAD ONE)....HIS IDLED TOO HIGH, RAN ROUGH AND WOULD SHUT OFF, WHEN HE STOPPED. I TOLD HIM I WOULD HELP HIM (HE TOOK THAT TO MEAN, HE WOULD DROP IT OFF AND PAY ME). RICK HAS PAID FOR AUTO WORK ALL OF HIS LIFE.
RICK WAS WRONG!!!
I PROVIDED THE DRIVEWAY AND GARAGE
I SHOWED HIM WHAT NEEDED TO BE DONE---MADE HIM DO IT!
I EXPLAINED EVERYTHING TO HIM---TIMING----ALL THE WAY DOWN TO THE 4 STROKES OF A 4 STROKE ENGINE....HE IS EAGER FOR MORE!
I SUPPLIED ALL OF THE TOOLS, METERS, MANUALS ETC.
RICK BOASTS ON WHAT HE HAS ACHIEVED.....I'M PROUD OF HIM TOO!
THIS IS WHAT I REALLY TRY TO DO FOR THE CJs THAT COME TO 2CARPROS
THE LAST PIC IS MY '77 CJ 5----IT'S BASICALLY HOW YOUR '85 STARTED OUT.....THERE WAS LITTLE CRAP, AND NO COMPUTER
I HAVE MADE MANY MODIFICATIONS TO MAKE MY WHOLE JEEP EVEN MORE USER-FRIENDLIER
YOU WILL SEE IN THIS PIC MY "OFFENHAUSER" 4 BBL INTAKE AND MY HOLLEY 390 CFM CARB (IT IS "CORRECTLY JETTED", FOR MY DRIVING HABITS USING AN O2 SENSOR AND AN AIR/ FUEL RATIO GAUGE, PERMANENTLY INSTALLED)....I GET ABOUT 18 MPG ON THE HWY
I HAVE OWNED NOTHING BUT CJs SINCE I GOT MY DRIVER'S LICENSE IN 1981 (PRESENTLY HAVE #S 6 AND 7 [7, IS A '46 WILLYS])
I HAVE TRIED NEARLY EVERY "GIMMICK" TO IMPROVE MPGs, I WAS ONLY ABLE TO GET ABOUT 16 MPGs FROM A BBD CONSISTENTLY....THEN I TRIED A WEBER DGEV, AND NOW THE HOLLEY........THE HOLLEY IS EZ TO ADJUST, PARTS ARE LOCAL, MPG IS GREAT, LOTS OF POWER IF I GET ON IT, COMPARED TO THE OTHERS......I DON'T "GET ON IT" OFTEN
DOES YOUR NEW CARB HAVE A STEPPER, AND HOOK ON TO THE CJs CONNECTOR?
None of the computer & vacuum stuff is left, most have been removed! See pic. No "stepper" on the carb.
I do not see the need either, but at the time of install I was trying to follow directions exactly. The install went well and the carb has worked fine since March 2006.
I "repaired" my the module to have it tested, however none of the local auto parts have a "working" tester. NAPA said they did not have one!! So it looks like I have hit a dead end here, and not able to test the ign module.
My pics seem to be large files so they may not get to you.
IF FUNDS ARE AN ISSUE
GRAB A NEW TAB
TYPE IN "PROMO CODES FOR _____" (ADVANCE AUTO, AUTOZONE, WHERE EVER!) LOOK FOR THE BEST DEAL YOU CAN FIND (SOME EVEN HAVE COUPONS FOR LATER)
THEN GO TO THEIR ONLINE SITE
PUT IN YOU VEHICLE INFO, CLICK START SHOPPING, FIND YOUR MODULE
TAKE IT TO SHOPPING CART, INSTALL YOUR PROMO CODE, THEN PURCHASE IT ON LINE, PRINT YOUR RECEIPT ........INSTEAD OF SHIPPING IT TO YOU, PICK IT UP AT THE STORE!
I'VE SEEN PEOPLE SAVE 40% BUYING BATTERIES AND OTHER STUFF, DOING IT THIS WAY!
LIFETIME WARRANTY ALSO, IF THEY CANNOT TEST THIS ONE, THEY SHOULD HONOR THE WARRANTY AND DEFECT IT OUT AND GIVE YOU ANOTHER
IT'S NOT GONNA HURT TO KEEP A SPARE ONE, EVEN IF THE OTHER "IS GOOD"
I KEEP A SPARE IGN MODULE, FUEL PUMP, AND COIL IN MY JEEP AT ALL TIMES, ALONG WITH MANY TOOLS AND SMALL PARTS FOR ANYTHING
THE AUTO SALVAGE YARD--SELF SERVE TYPE, MIGHT EVEN BE CHEAPER----ANY '70s OR '80s FORD VEHICLE WITH A MODULE THAT LOOKS LIKE YOURS WILL WORK....KEEP IN MIND WHERE THE WIRES COME OUT OF IT HAS A "BLUE" PLASTIC WIRE HOLDER, YOU MUST GET THE SAME (RED, YELLOW, ETC. PLASTIC THINGEE IS NOT THE SAME AS YOURS) SEE THE "BLUE" IN MY LINK ABOVEAT MY LOCAL SALVAGE YARDS, THIS MIGHT COST $5 DOWN TO THEM JUST GIVING IT TO ME.
I'M GONNA SEND YOU PRIVATE MESSAGE, TO GET TO IT, CLICK ON YOUR NAME AT THE TOP OF THE PAGE, THEN LOOK TO THE LEFT FOR MESSAGES
WE'RE KINDA STUCK, NOT KNOWING WHETHER YOUR OLD MODULE IS GOOD, OR EVEN IF A NEW ONE IS GOOD....IT WOULD BE NICE TO TRY ANOTHER ONE TO GET US STARTED
THE BEST WAY TO REMOVE THE WIRES FROM A MODULE IS TO FIRMLY GRASP THE WIRES ON EITHER SIDE OF THE CONNECTOR AN PULL HARD (DIGGING AT THE CONNECTOR WITH A SCREWDRIVER, ETC. USUALLY JUST BREAKS OFF THE LOCKS) BESIDES, THE FACTORY MANUAL SAYS TO DO IT LIKE THAT
UNDER YOUR HOOD LOOKS GOOD!....MIGHT STILL, ELIMINATE MORE USELESS CRAP!
A/C IS CHEATING! (DOES A/C HAVE A WORKING SOLENOID TO STEP UP IDLE WHEN THE A/C IS ON?)
LOOK FOR A MESSAGE SOON
LETS TRY 1950s "GRAND THEFT AUTO, JUST FOR A QUICK TEST
POSITIVE BATTERY TO POSITIVE COIL
SEE MY PICS---INSURE THE CONNECTIONS ARE GOOD!
COME BACK WITH YOUR RESULTS OF TRYING THIS, IT MAY STEER US IN A BETTER DIRECTION TO FIND THE PROBLEM
I DO HAVE PICS OF OTHER TESTS TO TRY IF NEED-BE --SO DO YOUR BEST WITH EACH
I'll get another NAPA module tomorrow. I'm thinking of not "modify" this one at first, then see if it'll start or try to lite off. Your thoughts?